HTTP/1.1 -1 Read error in cache disk data: SuccessContent-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Last-Modified: Sat, 22 Jan 2022 04:39:35 GMT Content-length: 22160 Connection: Close Proxy-Connection: Close X-Cache: HIT from web1.osuosl.org Server: ProxyTrack 0.5 (HTTrack 3.49.2) This page documents some of the amusing things said in #parrot. It's not really useful, but it helps with -Ofun. Feel free to add your own quotes (preferably from #parrot or parrot-devel). {{{ Whiteknight> i'm going to solve this issue if it kills me Whiteknight> and then I'm going to be all like "oh noes, it killz me! LOL" }}} {{{ particle> don't touch that code! it worked yesterday. mostly. }}} {{{ chromatic> Mac OS X will eventually provide a single header, called "oohshiny.h" with a single function called "NSPushCandyColoredButton()". Coke> I am drooling in anticipation of how shiny that button is! }}} {{{ cotto> now to tackle "DOD" moritz> department of defense? ;-) szbalint> dangers of drinking Infinoid> Donuts On Demand chromatic> Donut Order Detection moritz> doughnuts of desaster szbalint> DOD Ought Dereference chromatic> DOD of Recursing Daemons Infinoid> devil's own doggy Infinoid> deathtrap of despair }}} {{{ particle> $haze_the_new_guy->() whiteknight> am I still the new guy? particle> if you have to ask... whiteknight> damnit }}} {{{ particle> i'll work on a shell alias for maek without a macarthur grant. particle> i'm not proud. chromatic> Scab. You're pushing wages down. }}} {{{ chromatic> ...and I'll slap the hand of anyone who suggests that we need to *mark* and *sweep* these elements -- if you're lucky. If you're not lucky, I'll take away your birthday. }}} {{{ Whiteknight> well, I'm sorry to hear that. Speaking of wireless networking, I'm about 30 seconds away from breaking my goddamned router into a billion pieces Infinoid> chances are, it isn't running my code then :) Whiteknight> no, it's some piece of shit netgear router. worst. router. ever. rurban> who in the world buys this crap Infinoid> Whiteknight, apparently }}} {{{ Whiteknight> We have an RT ticket that requests the creation of a BigNum PMC. ergo, I am writing one Whiteknight> and when we decide that it's a stupid thing to have, we can open a second ticket to have it removed Whiteknight> ...and I'll rake in the karma on both transactions :) }}} {{{ Coke> We do not need to reinvent every wheel. We're already reinventing several as it stands. }}} {{{ chromatic> But we have backwards compatibility with Perl 4 to consider, so we can't change too much. }}} {{{ chromatic> Want to work on a GC? PerlJam> GC is completely opaque to me other than general concepts. chromatic> Then you're qualified. }}} {{{ Coke> Whiteknight: lucky for your, partcl doesn't use pct. Coke> *you Whiteknight> what does partcl use instead? jonathan> Whiteknight: It's written in a combination of bf and lolcode. }}} {{{ Whiteknight> oh great, I can just imagine what a recursive descent parser must look like in bf chromatic> Just like any other bf code, really. }}} {{{ NotFound> PerlJam: at least you realize that others countries exists ;) pmichaud> NotFound: PerlJam and I are in Texas, so yes -- we know about the other 49 countries. }}} {{{ davidfetter> sam adams?!? in portland? i'd think in a brewpub town like portland, he'd lose on the name alone Whiteknight> yeah, that's why his opponent, Guinnes McBudweiser lost }}} {{{ Infinoid> I didn't distill anything, I just wrote it from scratch with malice aforethought. chromatic> Good. I'm concerned that we haven't done that enough recently. }}} {{{ * NotFound thinks about developping a floating point format with negative NaN Infinoid> how could you tell the difference between that and positive NaN? NotFound> Infinoid: that's the beauty of that design Infinoid> you could use negative NaN the way some perl 5 code uses "0 but true" NotFound> Will look nice: a = NaN but negative :) Infinoid> "They're just like normal NaN! Except they're EVIL." NotFound> Wait, NaN is already evil enough :D }}} {{{ japhb> OK, popping that discussion off the stack ... we clearly support gcc 3.4. How much older than that do we still support? rurban> 3.3 ? particle> no davidfetter> stack? i thought we used registers here ;) particle> and don't even ask about 2.7 rurban> 2.95 is still quite popular in academia chromatic> Academia should freakin' go outside once in a while. japhb> chromatic++ chromatic> HELLO FROM THE 21ST CENTURY PLEASE JOIN US THE WATER IS FINE }}} {{{ NotFound> "put exit at bottom or die" is valid perl6? moritz> it's just a string literal ;) NotFound> moritz: don't take it too literay NotFound> literaly Infinoid> metaphors are very literary. particle> i never met a phor i didn't like (or is) chromatic> I never metamodel not obsessed with reflection. }}} {{{ alvar> allison: would it be a good idea to build something which relies on threads on the current implementation? allison> alvar: you will likely run into some rough spots in the current threading implementation, but a real use for the threads implementation is a great way to shake out the bugs allison> alvar: so, I guess it depends on whether you're more of a "mountain bike" or "racing bike" kind of programmer Whiteknight> what's the difference? Whiteknight> ...besides the number of crashes Infinoid> big gnarly wheels and a penchant for running over small woodland creatures allison> alvar: "mountain bike" would be enjoying exploring rugged terrain, not minding a few bumps particle> the racing bike programmer wears a funny hat, too chromatic> If a mountain biker sees a goat, that's wonderful. If a racing biker sees a goat, something's wrong. }}} {{{ chromatic> We're still bound by the metaphysics of the language which state that there is no computer but a PDP and K&R is its prophet. }}} {{{ Tene> Wait, you mean I need to READ? Tene> I don't like the sound of this project. }}} {{{ Tene> Arson is a significantly underused motivational technique. }}} {{{ pmichaud> a failed Match is one where .to < .from moritz> so you don't support reversed Match objects? ;-) pmichaud> I do not. pmichaud> *something* has to be straight>forward< somewhere! pmichaud> :-P PerlJam> Just following the precedent of the arrow of time? :) pmichaud> It's a darn good precedent, and anyone who disagrees can go back and fix it. }}} {{{ Coke> ... you know, I really am not a fan of doing xml and text manipulation in Cold Fusion. :P particle> i know a language you can use to make that fun. particle> c! Infinoid> I've yet to find a language in which xml manipulation was fun. confound> LOLCAT * Infinoid shudders at the thought of doing xslt transforms in lolcode chromatic> You can remove "in lolcode" from that sentence and it's still true. particle> Infinoid: you obviously haven't been introduced to LOLPATH }}} {{{ chromatic> svn: Working copy path 'docs/book/appb_patch_submission.pod' does not exist in repository chromatic> Joy. chromatic> That's almost enough to make me want to put on leather pants and let Git hit me in the head with a baseball bat again. }}} {{{ bacek> whatever :) bacek> English is my forth language. bacek> After Russian, Rude Russian and Very Very Rude Russian :) }}} {{{ chromatic> Okay, serious question time. Why are some functions in src/gc/dod.c marked with PARROT_API? chromatic> "Hello embedders! I sweep the memory pools and make allocated thingies go away! Call me sometime big boy!" }}} {{{ tewk> If I add a STRING ATTR to a PMC do I need to write a custom mark routine? wknight-work> I would, yes Tene> It's gotten to the point where I think someone's talking about lolcode whenever I see people using ALL CAPS for a few words. wknight-work> i can haz all caps? Infinoid> caps lock is cruise control for AWESOME Tene> Yes, but you still need to steer. TimToady> that's a bunch of bull TimToady> .oO(was it something I said?) Infinoid> no, it was nothing... }}} {{{ Infinoid> So, um, if we must check the return value of Parrot_io_peek now, what should the peek op do if it receives the error? Return ""? Toss an exception? bacek> Eat kittens? bacek> O wait... Infinoid> mmm, kittens Infinoid> eating kittens is not O(1) tho bacek> hmm.. O(n) isn't bad either Infinoid> Parrot_io_kittens_eat(interp, pmc_new(enum_class_Kitten)) Infinoid> I'll make it return "" and see whether tests pass. bacek> Hmm... We can add Kitten in Core PMCs. bacek> Are you sure that it should be _io_ prefixed? Infinoid> Eating kittens seems like an input operation to me moritz> Parrot_i_kittens_eat(...) :-) Infinoid> maybe it should be classified as parsing, though. bacek> It will require some output later :) moritz> no, kittens are physically unique in that they can be turned into free energy, to 100% }}} {{{ * bacek is not very good writer in polite english. jonathan> bacek: Just try and limit yourself to one swear word per sentnece. :-) bacek> My dictionary for technical discussions usually includes words like "crap", "bullshit" and "OMG, do you really thinks using your brains?" * jonathan looks forward to an email containing all three }}} {{{ jonathan> You never really know a language until you know how to swear in it too. :-) szbalint> that's bullsh..I mean you're completely right :) }}} {{{ darbelo> We are, like, totally optimal now. }}} {{{ * bacek spent few hours on Keys, Iterators and Hashes... bacek> I have one question - who designed it? So I can visit him with baseball bat in hands... chromatic> I'm not sure anyone designed it. bacek> oh shi... }}} {{{ chromatic> Make up a plan for what to do, and we'll see what we can do. bacek> ok. I'll try to make some .plan without using my favourite sentences about technical design. chromatic> "You are all idiots. I've known monkeys who can write code better than you. You are the universe's version of technical debt. I've sneezed better programs than you could ever write." bacek> Something like this :) chromatic> "There is a picture of your program next to the word CRACK in the dictionary." bacek> Small mistake. It's after "CRAP" :) chromatic> "If dmr read your program, he would invent time travel to prevent himself from inventing C so that you could never perpetuate such horror upon the world." bacek> dmr? purl> well, dmr is Dennis Ritchie, author of Unix and C; he is our Grey Eminence, and King. or at http://cm.bell-labs.com/cm/cs/who/dmr/ chromatic> "The only thing worse than your code is the compiler which allowed it." bacek> wow, we did you get it? I need this source of wisdom for my day-to-day technical discussions! bacek> s/we/where/ }}} {{{ NotFound> I don't see a close method in the socket pmc. Whiteknight> how does an open socket become closed then? chromatic> Velociraptors. Whiteknight> damnit, the velociraptors didn't make it into the branch NotFound> goto close; TimToady> whew, that was a close call... }}} {{{ pmichaud> "Write a good code profiler, get free brownies. Can't beat that." Coke> what if I write a crappy one? ;) Whiteknight> NO BROWNIES FOR YOU! pmichaud> your brownies are still free, but they have side effects Whiteknight> crappy profiler == crappy brownies }}} From Yapc10/PVMW: {{{ Austin_Hastings> What are you doing to parrot? Whiteknight> I buttocks parrot }}} {{{ "I may never wash my car again." - Whiteknight, after giving Larry a ride during YAPC10 }}} {{{ "I'm a luminary now." - particle "I'm going to go look that up." - jhorwitz }}} {{{ "Remember, until you admit there is a solution, there is no problem." - particle (commenting on the stance of jhorwitz's clueless ex-manager) }}} {{{ cotto> but I take taking myself seriously seriously }}} {{{ moritz> you must be doing something wrong :-) Whiteknight> I'm usually doing something wrong :) }}} {{{ Infinoid> Actually I've been threatening to show up at Whiteknight's house with a pizza one of these days anyway kid51> The only fundamental difference between your showing up at Whiteknight's house with pizza and a full-fledged hackathon is that the hackathon is announced in advance and is open admission. kid51> Much pizza is consumed at hackathons. }}} {{{ Infinoid> getting it to work on win32 will require going to the win32 machine in the living room, which also implies getting out of bed, so I am carefully ordering my priorities }}} {{{ chromatic> Yes, they're tied together like two things tied together. * Tene ties chromatic to chromatic. chromatic> I can defeat you with mitosis. }}} {{{ bacek_at_work: I disagree, but not enough to argue. Coke: where "language spec" tests should go? "this is me, not arguing." }}} {{{ a proc that has about 1000 * that length takes about 8s to compile. Wow. a proc that has about 2000 * that length takes about 35s to compile. Big O, Little O... I'm the one with the gun. }}} {{{ darbelo> Boy, is the code to freeze PMCs ehm... special. chromatic> Very. Whiteknight> NO SARCASM! Whiteknight> that code is shit and will be addressed as such }}} {{{ I can't even spell PMC. }}} {{{ I'd explain exactly how and why it's wrong, but you don't want to know and, despite my reputation for barbaric and unprovoked hostility, I respect your blissful ignorance of this small evil. }}} {{{ Coke> retrying with head... damnit, it works again. I mean, YAY. }}} {{{ darbelo> Sounds good to me. Write a preprocessor and make everybody happy. Well, except Coke, but he should be used to that by now. }}} {{{ dukeleto> anybody have any thoughts about Go? http://golang.org/doc/go_faq.html Whiteknight> isn't that a game that I'm terrible at? dukeleto: that looks very interesting Austin> Dude, that language will never succeed. Remember the rule. plobsing> and what rule is that exactly? Austin> No language with ':=' will ever succeed. plobsing> touche Austin> It's the operator of doom. }}} {{{ Austin> ... There's never a committer around when you need one. Austin> Maybe I should say "donuts" Austin> See if one shows up. chromatic> A donut or a committer? Austin> Works every time }}} {{{ pmichaud> disappearing again to focus on eval... pmichaud> afk, shopping }}} {{{ Whiteknight> false alarm on the t/op/annotate.t failure. I had an installed parrot conflicting with my build directory chromatic> You send him to school, you buy him books, you read his thesis, and he still types 'make install'. }}} {{{ dukeleto> chromatic: i can pretend to know stuff and you can pretend to believe me. that usually works. }}} {{{ Coke> (so, just one more "find_name" there.) Coke> (because someone could, of course, [rename unknown {}] Coke> (oy) cotto> those tcl guys really know how to party }}} {{{ NotFound> There wasn't a plan to rename p6object to some more language agnostic? Austin> Sure. It used to be called Perl6Object. Now the p stands for pmichaud. NotFound> And the 6? ;) Austin> ta-da! Probably a counting error - like i19n except it should have been P7 atrick ? That's 6 NotFound> I feel much better now. }}} {{{ dukeleto> darn. i wrote a test for the gc memory leak, but it passes on 2.1.0 Whiteknight> we need to file a bug report for the test, and write a test to prove that the test is fixed }}} {{{ Whiteknight> urg it's amazing parrot works at all when I hear this stuff ... plobsing> It runs on the sanity of developers. }}} {{{ Whiteknight> yeah, I definitely want to get in there and gussy up some of that shit }}} {{{ allison> bacon is the new pony }}} {{{ whiteknight> on the bright side, I've gotten much better at typing with one hand }}} {{{ Whiteknight> I was just talking to my dog about TT #389. He says i'ts a government conspiracy Whiteknight> it's funny, I didn't think I had a dog }}} {{{ Whiteknight> look, I'm not saying it's perfect or that we're going to get maximum performance where all our dynamic overhead evaporates into a fine mist of unicorn farts }}} {{{ dukeleto> what is the best way to convert a Parrot_String into a cstring ? Parrot_str_to_cstring, it seems darbelo> dukeleto: Yeah, that's the one. sorear: the alternative is to break encapsulation and read from the STRING's internal buffer. But that's an evil practice I've tried to rid parrot's core of, and if you do it in a extension I'll shuffle the struct's member daily just to break your code ;) }}} {{{ bacek> chromatic, are you merging immutable_strings? chromatic> Happy to. chromatic> I hadn't started yet. bacek> ok chromatic> Are you asking because you want me to, you want me to wait, you're doing it, or you're waiting outside my door with a cookie and a baseball bat, hoping I'll check the mail? }}} {{{ smash> hello everyone Coke> can't resist... hulk? purl> Hulk SMASH!!! Coke> botsnack! purl> thanks Coke :) }}} {{{ sorear> bacek: What does gc_tms do? Just non-incremental tricolor? sorear> (Why is it called GC Massacre if you're adding GCs?) bacek> sorear, yes. It's described on GCMassacre wiki page sorear, I'm going to kill Memory_Pools, old GC, and maybe few kittens mikehh> bacek: as long as you leave the poor puppies alone :-} cotto> parrot: r47177 | cotto++ | branches/puppy_massacre: parrot: Create a branch to remove all puppies. We only like parrots. parrot: review: http://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/47174/ }}} {{{ whiteknight> interp->HLL_namespace is a hash, not a namespace whiteknight> and interp->class_hash is a namespace, not a hash whiteknight> I love this code with all my heart }}} {{{ whiteknight> how do I get the stdout FileHandle in current parrot? bacek> whiteknight, step 1 - checkout gc_massacre branch. step 2 - gdb --args ./parrot --gc-debug t/compilers/imcc/syn/labels.t bacek> After fixing assert failure you'll reach nirvana and filehandle will appear in your hand }}} {{{ cotto> The code needs love and tries to fill the void by eating memory. chromatic> Just like me and pie. }}} {{{ cotto_work> Maybe the new POST should have a different name. cotto_work> PIST, PEST and PUST are open tcurtis> Don't forget, PYST. cotto_work> then again, maybe we should stick with POST sorear> don't forget, darbelo is opening up an infinity of new vowels sorear> (a countable infinity, but still) darbelo> PST NotFound> You can leave your hat on.... cotto_work> P☺ST bacek> cotto_work, it's still POST :) NotFound> But happier :) }}} {{{ darbelo> Heh. Looks like we have 6 different platform specific definitions for a function we never use :) particle> we strive for portability }}} {{{ chromatic> This implies that contexts may need the VM equivalent of human-sized windows in their restrooms in case vampires break in the front door looking for us. chromatic> I recommend distracting them with the flaming curtains, but we can't always rely on that. }}} {{{ whiteknight> we don't need to go crazy rewriting design documents for systems we're not planning to do serious work on plobsing> I guess my question boils down to: do we keep or delete the PDDs we're not willing to invest time in? whiteknight> bump them all back to the "drafts" folder whiteknight> or a fancy new "old" folder plobsing> I suggest /pdd/outright-lies or /pdd/wishful-thinking whiteknight> specificity. I like that }}} {{{ whiteknight> rakudo usually builds pretty well on my dev box. but I'm on a mem-constrained VM here whiteknight> the thrashing is strong with this one moritz> .oO( the thrashing will always be with you, young knight ) }}} {{{ whiteknight> what kind of feed? dukeleto> rss feed dukeleto> or cattle feed, whichever is cheaper }}} {{{ whiteknight> if we can get one or two big branches merged, that would be nice dukeleto> whiteknight: too vague. whiteknight> that's the way I like it }}} {{{ whiteknight> GSOC next year should have some awesome projects whiteknight> they should do one every season: a winter of code, autumn of code, spring of code NotFound> An april fool's of code will be nice, too. whiteknight> NotFound: we only offer one project: Solve the halting problem using only Parrot whiteknight> Notfound: but we introduce a GC bug so the answer is always "yes" }}} {{{ whiteknight> when he started talking about a "lazy stream of parse trees", I thought to myself "I don't know what any of those words mean, but I MUST HAVE IT" }}} {{{ <@cotto> if you need more than you find in Mastering Regular Expressions, you're either doing it wrong or maintaining a regex engine }}} {{{ Matt-GCI **waits while emacs compiles... rfw enjoy your lisp interpreter Matt-GCI something against lisp? rfw (no (not (really))) }}} {{{ dukeleto> rfw: are you sacrificing virgin goats to the dynop gods? rfw> dukeleto: i'm not sure whether i should say yes or no }}} {{{ dukeleto> cotto_work: in the beginning, there is only "core" NotFound> Sometimes "core dump" }}}s="wiki"> 21:15 ParrotQuotes edited by cotto
dukeleto explains it (diff)
19:49 Ticket